Re: Oracle Express

Ian Michael Gumby wrote: > > > > Subject: Re: Oracle Express > > From: damorgan@psoug.org > > Date: Tue, 11 Nov 2008 16:17:20 -0800 > > To: informix-list@iiug.org > > > > Fernando Nunes wrote: > > > > > There are a lot of "free" databases out there... > > > Oracle Express, DB2 Express, all the open sources (postgres, mysql?, > > > derby, Ingres, Firebird etc.) > > > If free is a requisite, just choose the one you like... > > > Many of them don't have any kind of restriction (license > restrictions I > > > mean) > > > Regards. > > > > And all but two that you mention are not compatible with an > > organization's enterprise systems. If you want free you can > > get free. If you want free with seamless compatibility you > > either pay a price in dollars or some restrictions. > > -- > > What a maroon. > > Daniel, the OP runs IDS and is asking how to save on licenses by > switching to a *free* version of something. > > 1) OP should know already that there is a cost in doing the migration to > any platform. Management made the decision. Did you miss that part? > 2) Based on what OP is doing, there may be a cheaper license that he > can try and get using IDS. Cheaper than free? You mean there are companies that will pay us to use their product? Please list them. > 3) By going to an Open Source option, he saves on license costs and may > not have any inhibitors on performance. Or by using the free copies of DB2 or Oracle may get robust functionality that is fully compatible with other systems in the enterprise and don't require training. Have you ever tried to recover from file corruption in some of those free products like MySQL and PostgreSQL? Have you ever actually taken them into a lab and forced failures? Did point-in-time recovery work? > Depending on his needs, he could switch to JavaDB/Derby/Cloudscape. Of > course that would mean that they would need some java skills in house. My point exactly. > Note too that there are people who have databases in production where 1 > table exceeds the crippled release from Oracle. Organizations, with that much data, can afford to buy a license. Lets see: Oracle SE1 Named User License: $180 ... with a 5 user minimum that puts it at $900. That should bust the corporate bank account and force layoffs. If price was a barrier then likely these numbers would have changed over the last year ... http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9025203 they haven't. Neither have these (dice.com as of 11/14/2008): Oracle 15,114 jobs SQL Server 11,406 DB2 2,139 MySQL 1,999 Sybase 1,203 COBOL 836 Teradata 458 Pick 306 Informix 253 RPG 249 PostgreSQL 209 But hey you're keeping ahead of RPG. That's something you can tell mom about when you go home for the holidays. -- Daniel A. Morgan University of Washington damorgan@x.washington.edu (replace x with u to respond)

DA Morgan wrote: > Neither have these (dice.com as of 11/14/2008): Danny boy, have you seen this website? It's got thousands of Informix jobs! http://tinyurl.com/8xb -- Cheers, Obnoxio The Clown http://obotheclown.blogspot.com

The problem with numbers like those you cited is they can not distinguish between a) Lots of jobs because lots of customers b) Lots of jobs because the database requires lots of hand-holding c) Some combination of (a) and (b) As Disraeli said, "There are ... lies, damned lies, and statistics." It is not unusual for a single DBA to manage several hundred IDS instances. My understanding is that it is also not unusual for a single Oracle instance to require more than a one DBA. Thus 253 IDS openings might mean 25,000 instances, whereas 15,114 Oracle openings might mean 10,000 instances. IDS is healthy in the marketplace and delivering great value to its numerous and growing customer base. -- Kevin Cherkauer Software Engineer IBM Informix Dynamic Server -- Database Kernel "DA Morgan" <damorgan@psoug.org> wrote: > Neither have these (dice.com as of 11/14/2008): > Oracle 15,114 jobs > SQL Server 11,406 > DB2 2,139 > MySQL 1,999 > Sybase 1,203 > COBOL 836 > Teradata 458 > Pick 306 > Informix 253 > RPG 249 > PostgreSQL 209

Kevin Cherkauer wrote: > The problem with numbers like those you cited is they can not distinguish > between > a) Lots of jobs because lots of customers > b) Lots of jobs because the database requires lots of hand-holding > c) Some combination of (a) and (b) > As Disraeli said, "There are ... lies, damned lies, and statistics." > > It is not unusual for a single DBA to manage several hundred IDS instances. > My understanding is that it is also not unusual for a single Oracle instance > to require more than a one DBA. Thus 253 IDS openings might mean 25,000 > instances, whereas 15,114 Oracle openings might mean 10,000 instances. > > IDS is healthy in the marketplace and delivering great value to its numerous > and growing customer base. There is little problem distinguishing between them ... one reads the job descriptions if one is interested. The numbers are really rather clear. If you are a stockholder what you care about is revenue generated. If you are in sales or marketing you care about quotas. If you are a developer or DBA you care about jobs and job security: Which are you? And why is this important? Because lets assume you created the perfect database and ran it on a perfect operating system on the perfect hardware. One hardware sale, one O/S license, one DB license. And everyone is unemployed. That ranks right up there with other Utopian concepts that have zero value. If you think a couple of hundred IDS openings is an indication of a vibrant marketplace with new licenses and new projects you are a member of a very exclusive club. -- Daniel A. Morgan University of Washington damorgan@x.washington.edu (replace x with u to respond)

Obnoxio The Clown wrote: > DA Morgan wrote: >> Neither have these (dice.com as of 11/14/2008): > > Danny boy, have you seen this website? It's got thousands of Informix jobs! > > http://tinyurl.com/8xb Jobs that you, and you alone, are uniquely qualified to fill. -- Daniel A. Morgan University of Washington damorgan@x.washington.edu (replace x with u to respond)

DA Morgan wrote: > Obnoxio The Clown wrote: >> DA Morgan wrote: >>> Neither have these (dice.com as of 11/14/2008): >> Danny boy, have you seen this website? It's got thousands of Informix jobs! >> >> http://tinyurl.com/8xb > > Jobs that you, and you alone, are uniquely qualified to fill. I think you're far too modest Danny boy. In all my years in IT, I have never met anyone more suited to the jobs on that site. -- Cheers, Obnoxio The Clown http://obotheclown.blogspot.com

DA Morgan wrote: > Kevin Cherkauer wrote: >> The problem with numbers like those you cited is they can not >> distinguish between >> a) Lots of jobs because lots of customers >> b) Lots of jobs because the database requires lots of hand-holding >> c) Some combination of (a) and (b) >> As Disraeli said, "There are ... lies, damned lies, and statistics." >> >> It is not unusual for a single DBA to manage several hundred IDS >> instances. My understanding is that it is also not unusual for a >> single Oracle instance to require more than a one DBA. Thus 253 IDS >> openings might mean 25,000 instances, whereas 15,114 Oracle openings >> might mean 10,000 instances. >> >> IDS is healthy in the marketplace and delivering great value to its >> numerous and growing customer base. > > There is little problem distinguishing between them ... one reads > the job descriptions if one is interested. > > The numbers are really rather clear. If you are a stockholder what > you care about is revenue generated. If you are in sales or marketing > you care about quotas. If you are a developer or DBA you care about > jobs and job security: Which are you? > > And why is this important? Because lets assume you created the > perfect database and ran it on a perfect operating system on the > perfect hardware. One hardware sale, one O/S license, one DB > license. And everyone is unemployed. That ranks right up there > with other Utopian concepts that have zero value. > > If you think a couple of hundred IDS openings is an indication of > a vibrant marketplace with new licenses and new projects you are a > member of a very exclusive club. I have yet to see a job posting for an Energizer battery operator. Yet few question that Energizer has a decent market position. Cheers Serge -- Serge Rielau DB2 Solutions Development IBM Toronto Lab

"Serge Rielau" <srielau@ca.ibm.com> wrote in message news:6o8165F2aksbU1@mid.individual.net... > I have yet to see a job posting for an Energizer battery operator. > Yet few question that Energizer has a decent market position. Mrs Pedantic reckons that her Rabbit runs far longer on these than other competitive products.

> From: invalid_address@nowhere.com > Subject: Re: Oracle Express > Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2008 17:12:33 -0800 > To: informix-list@iiug.org > > The problem with numbers like those you cited is they can not distinguish > between > a) Lots of jobs because lots of customers > b) Lots of jobs because the database requires lots of hand-holding > c) Some combination of (a) and (b) > As Disraeli said, "There are ... lies, damned lies, and statistics." > > It is not unusual for a single DBA to manage several hundred IDS instances. > My understanding is that it is also not unusual for a single Oracle instance > to require more than a one DBA. Thus 253 IDS openings might mean 25,000 > instances, whereas 15,114 Oracle openings might mean 10,000 instances. > > IDS is healthy in the marketplace and delivering great value to its numerous > and growing customer base. > > -- > Kevin Cherkauer > Software Engineer > IBM Informix Dynamic Server -- Database Kernel > Naw, really? Don't bother telling that to Daniel. What to add a twist to what Daniel is showing? How about the fact that many of those job postings are repeat postings for the same spot. Company A has an opening. Unless they have a Procurement Office and a short vendor list, when they post for a position, every consulting shop on their vendor list gets an e-mail and then posts for the positions. So you may see 10 different companies posting for the *single* position. Informix DBA? How many times have we seen companies use the "good 'ol boy network" to get a top notch person and bypass the hoard on Dice? Daniel's numbers don't consider that. Then there's the issue that IDS customers don't need a hoard of DBAs to keep their systems running. At a minimum you will always need two DBAs. (Hit by Truck) Ok, 1 1/2 DBAs would cover that. How many DBAs does Wally Mart have running their store systems? I mean for all of their stores world wide? You couldn't do that with Oracle. Speaking of which, Oracle is susceptible to a nasty deadlock problem on machines that become constrained. Like CPU constrained. Thats when you have to drop and restart the database to get back to work. Never had that problem with Informix... ;-) But hey! What do I know? ;-) -G _________________________________________________________________ Stay up to date on your PC, the Web, and your mobile phone with Windows Live http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/119462413/direct/01/

Serge Rielau wrote: > DA Morgan wrote: >> Kevin Cherkauer wrote: >>> The problem with numbers like those you cited is they can not >>> distinguish between >>> a) Lots of jobs because lots of customers >>> b) Lots of jobs because the database requires lots of hand-holding >>> c) Some combination of (a) and (b) >>> As Disraeli said, "There are ... lies, damned lies, and statistics." >>> >>> It is not unusual for a single DBA to manage several hundred IDS >>> instances. My understanding is that it is also not unusual for a >>> single Oracle instance to require more than a one DBA. Thus 253 IDS >>> openings might mean 25,000 instances, whereas 15,114 Oracle openings >>> might mean 10,000 instances. >>> >>> IDS is healthy in the marketplace and delivering great value to its >>> numerous and growing customer base. >> >> There is little problem distinguishing between them ... one reads >> the job descriptions if one is interested. >> >> The numbers are really rather clear. If you are a stockholder what >> you care about is revenue generated. If you are in sales or marketing >> you care about quotas. If you are a developer or DBA you care about >> jobs and job security: Which are you? >> >> And why is this important? Because lets assume you created the >> perfect database and ran it on a perfect operating system on the >> perfect hardware. One hardware sale, one O/S license, one DB >> license. And everyone is unemployed. That ranks right up there >> with other Utopian concepts that have zero value. >> >> If you think a couple of hundred IDS openings is an indication of >> a vibrant marketplace with new licenses and new projects you are a >> member of a very exclusive club. > I have yet to see a job posting for an Energizer battery operator. > Yet few question that Energizer has a decent market position. > > Cheers > Serge Perhaps you aren't looking in the right place. Send me your resume in one of these: http://www.costumzee.com/tag/energizer+bunny/ and I'll pass it on. -- Daniel A. Morgan University of Washington damorgan@x.washington.edu (replace x with u to respond)