Archive retention

General question for the production dba's out there... How long do you retain your onbar backups? This stems from a somewhat funny discussion the other day where folks were wanting to keep backups for SEVEN years - when I pointed out that in seven years we would be at least a couple versions ahead of the one used to perform the oldest backup there was a collective "Ohhhhh yeahhhhh" in the group. I suggested a retention period of no more than one year but am curious to know what you all do? Mike

It actually depends much more of the company policy needs, and also of the kind of backup media involved, (how high is the media level available during monts/years pass ??) And I don´t see any practical need to retain an backup of the same db version and all older than 1, or 2 years (presuming the data on the engine is *never* expurged from times to times!!!!) Regards. Alexandre Marini Tecnologia da Informação - DBA SEFAZ-MS / SGI-UIMP / Sistemas IBM-Informix IIUG Member <http://www.iiug.org>; MIKE MAGIE escreveu: > General question for the production dba's out there... > > How long do you retain your onbar backups? > > This stems from a somewhat funny discussion the other day where folks were > wanting to keep backups for SEVEN years - when I pointed out that in seven > years we would be at least a couple versions ahead of the one used to perform > the oldest backup there was a collective "Ohhhhh yeahhhhh" in the group. I > suggested a retention period of no more than one year but am curious to know > what you all do? > > Mike > > > ******************************************************************************* > Forum Note: Use "Reply" to post a response in the discussion forum. > > >

Thanks for the reply - Yeah I know my orgs needs - I am curious about your orgs needs - what your retention periods are. MM

If they need to keep backups for seven years, then they need to conside= r using some form of data extraction to unload/reload the system such as dbexport, HPL, and/or external tables. = From: "MIKE MAGIE" <jmmagie@yahoo.com> = = To: ids@iiug.org = = Date: 11/05/2009 09:33 AM = = Subject: Archive retention [17947] = = Sent by: ids-bounces@iiug.org = = General question for the production dba's out there... How long do you retain your onbar backups? This stems from a somewhat funny discussion the other day where folks w= ere wanting to keep backups for SEVEN years - when I pointed out that in se= ven years we would be at least a couple versions ahead of the one used to perform the oldest backup there was a collective "Ohhhhh yeahhhhh" in the group= . I suggested a retention period of no more than one year but am curious to= know what you all do? Mike ***********************************************************************= ******** Forum Note: Use "Reply" to post a response in the discussion forum. =

At my current client (a government facility), ontape level 0 archives are currently kept for 40 days. This is to allow them, if there is any type of data descrancy reported in 30 days, an archive can be scoured to get the contents of a table that may have been acted upon by a bug in the code. Currently, log files are also keep for the same 40 days; however, I am suggesting modifying the policy for a maximum of 7 days of logical logs. They have a secondary server the same size, etc. as the production server to recover the data onto. Does your facility have the same? If not and if you have to go back a year, how are you going to recover the archive without overlaying your current production data? Once you have migrated your database to a different version and the old engine's code has been removed from the server, all proceeding archives and logs should be expired / deleted as you can never use them again. If your database migrates to new port of even the same engine, again -- time to expire / delete old archives/logs. You can never go back again ... at least for a production restore. Take care. Clifton > To: ids@iiug.org > From: jmmagie@yahoo.com > Subject: Archive retention [17947] > Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 10:31:54 -0500 > > General question for the production dba's out there... > > How long do you retain your onbar backups? > > This stems from a somewhat funny discussion the other day where folks were > wanting to keep backups for SEVEN years - when I pointed out that in seven > years we would be at least a couple versions ahead of the one used to perform > the oldest backup there was a collective "Ohhhhh yeahhhhh" in the group. I > suggested a retention period of no more than one year but am curious to know > what you all do? > > Mike > > > ******************************************************************************* > Forum Note: Use "Reply" to post a response in the discussion forum. > _________________________________________________________________ Find the right PC with Windows 7 and Windows Live. http://www.microsoft.com/Windows/pc-scout/laptop-set-criteria.aspx?cbid=wl&filt= 200,2400,10,19,1,3,1,7,50,650,2,12,0,1000&cat=1,2,3,4,5,6&brands=5,6,7,8,9,10,11 ,12,13,14,15,16&addf=4,5,9&ocid=PID24727::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WWL_WIN_evergree n2:112009

Yeah we do have a hotsite backup server. And we do unloads of databases that we retain for the 7 year period. It is a GOV site that I am at so our rules are a little different than many - anyhoo thanks. MM

Does that means I need to throw out those 5.25" floppied I backed up to? No point to a backup unless you can restore it. I keep a 5.25" floppy drive (and cable) around JIC. Haven't used it for a while, but every once in a while... Same way with the SW, keep a copy of the older engines (or unload to ASCII files). Financial institutions are required by law to retain 7 years worth of info. Other places not, - as suggested, it's really a business question. Once that is answered, then it's just a matter of how to satisfy that requirement. cheers j. Sane ego te vocavi. Forsitan capedictum tuum desit. -----Original Message----- From: ids-bounces@iiug.org [mailto:ids-bounces@iiug.org]On Behalf Of MIKE MAGIE Sent: Thursday, November 05, 2009 10:32 AM To: ids@iiug.org Subject: Archive retention [17947] General question for the production dba's out there... How long do you retain your onbar backups? This stems from a somewhat funny discussion the other day where folks were wanting to keep backups for SEVEN years - when I pointed out that in seven years we would be at least a couple versions ahead of the one used to perform the oldest backup there was a collective "Ohhhhh yeahhhhh" in the group. I suggested a retention period of no more than one year but am curious to know what you all do? Mike **************************************************************************** *** Forum Note: Use "Reply" to post a response in the discussion forum.

> General question for the production dba's out there... > > How long do you retain your onbar backups? > > This stems from a somewhat funny discussion the other day where folks were > wanting to keep backups for SEVEN years - when I pointed out that in seven > years we would be at least a couple versions ahead of the one used to > perform the oldest backup there was a collective "Ohhhhh yeahhhhh" in the > group. I suggested a retention period of no more than one year but am > curious to know what you all do? > I would suggest to the other folks that if records are important for seven years, they need to look at some sort of historical database to gather the stuff. If it's important, turn it into a project!

> Does that means I need to throw out those 5.25" floppied I backed up to? > 5.25? Newbie! Real old-timers still have some 8" lying around.

Can you say Data Warehouse Project!?!?!?!? Ar Art S. Kagel Oninit (www.oninit.com) IIUG Board of Directors (art@iiug.org) Disclaimer: Please keep in mind that my own opinions are my own opinions and do not reflect on my employer, Oninit, the IIUG, nor any other organization with which I am associated either explicitly or implicitly. Neither do those opinions reflect those of other individuals affiliated with any entity with which I am affiliated nor those of the entities themselves. On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 5:46 PM, Andrew Clarke <aclarke@civica.com.au> wrote: > > General question for the production dba's out there... > > > > How long do you retain your onbar backups? > > > > This stems from a somewhat funny discussion the other day where folks > were > > wanting to keep backups for SEVEN years - when I pointed out that in > seven > > years we would be at least a couple versions ahead of the one used to > > perform the oldest backup there was a collective "Ohhhhh yeahhhhh" in the > > group. I suggested a retention period of no more than one year but am > > curious to know what you all do? > > > > I would suggest to the other folks that if records are important for seven > years, they need to look at some sort of historical database to gather the > stuff. If it's important, turn it into a project! > > > > ******************************************************************************* > Forum Note: Use "Reply" to post a response in the discussion forum. > > --0015174bdcc8027a040477a7b449

> Can you say Data Warehouse Project!?!?!?!? > Raaaa-ther!

On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 07:31, MIKE MAGIE <jmmagie@yahoo.com> wrote: > General question for the production dba's out there... > > How long do you retain your onbar backups? > > This stems from a somewhat funny discussion the other day where folks were > wanting to keep backups for SEVEN years - when I pointed out that in seven > years we would be at least a couple versions ahead of the one used to > perform > the oldest backup there was a collective "Ohhhhh yeahhhhh" in the group. I > suggested a retention period of no more than one year but am curious to > know > what you all do? > There can be legal reasons why you need to preserve 7 years of backups. If so, your backup strategy must be comprehensive enough to be able to recover the system 7 years later. Usually, the old hardware will be senile or gone - but unless you've switched platforms, you can probably run the old stuff on the new platform, even 7 years later. But, you will need 'the old stuff'. So, the archive strategy must include backups of the software that runs the DBMS as well as the data from the database. You also need to ensure that your chunk device names can be recreated sufficiently well - so you need to know what devices are needed, and how big they must be, and so on. Consider whether you need to recover the entire O/S - or the tools on the O/S. Also, for long-term backups across platforms and versions, it may be sensible to create DB-Export style dumps of the data - you can recover that onto more recent versions of IDS. However, in the absence of compelling legal reasons, a shorter retention period is sensible, and 1-2 years is likely to be right. You still need to consider the backup of the relevant software. -- Jonathan Leffler #include <disclaimer.h> Email: jleffler@earthlink.net, jleffler@us.ibm.com Guardian of DBD::Informix v2008.0513 -- http://dbi.perl.org/ "Blessed are we who can laugh at ourselves, for we shall never cease to be amused." NB: Please do not use this email for correspondence. I don't necessarily read it every week, even. Marie von Ebner-Eschenbach<http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/m/marie_von_ebneresch enbac.html> - "Even a stopped clock is right twice a day." --000e0cd216b2419c020477b74798

Thanks for all the replies. I was probably not clear enough in my original post. Like I mentioned, since my team supports the federal government we do have a requirement to keep data for seven years and have a solid method for doing that. The sole purpose of my initial post was to query other DBA's to see how long they were keeping their onbar archives. MM

We may keep 3 days worth of backups for a warehouse system that can't use data that far back. We may keep 1 week for customer ordering data that may constantly change. We may keep 1 month to 1-2 years for customer and contract orders. We then keep up to 7 years for legal and Government requirements. We keep a copy of every version of software that we use, when taking backups. I have had to rebuild a server, instance, and restore 7.30 or 9.21 in the past, but not very often. DBexports will be based on the dbschema at that time, which may change over time. You will have to dump this frequently, compress it, and then allow the server backup to manage it. How long will they keep the server backups? Thanks, ******************************************************************* Ernie Knox IT Database Administrator Specialist Sears Holdings 3333 Beverly Rd., B4-266A Hoffman Estates, IL. 60179 Office: (847) 286-5735 Email: Ernest.Knox@searshc.com Blackberry: 2244650553@messaging.sprintpcs.com Page via Skytel: 2244650553@sprint.skytel.com Informix or MySQL Primary: 9110210@skytel.com Informix or MySQL Secondary: 7276872@skytel.com " Yes we can make a Change! " " It's always a great day to watch Sports - GO LIONS, TIGERS, and BEARS! " " Lets not forget - GO Pistons and Red Wings! " GSU ******************************************************************* -----Original Message----- From: ids-bounces@iiug.org [mailto:ids-bounces@iiug.org] On Behalf Of Jonathan Leffler Sent: Friday, November 06, 2009 11:36 AM To: ids@iiug.org Subject: Re: Archive retention [17976] On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 07:31, MIKE MAGIE <jmmagie@yahoo.com> wrote: > General question for the production dba's out there... > > How long do you retain your onbar backups? > > This stems from a somewhat funny discussion the other day where folks were > wanting to keep backups for SEVEN years - when I pointed out that in seven > years we would be at least a couple versions ahead of the one used to > perform > the oldest backup there was a collective "Ohhhhh yeahhhhh" in the group. I > suggested a retention period of no more than one year but am curious to > know > what you all do? > There can be legal reasons why you need to preserve 7 years of backups. If so, your backup strategy must be comprehensive enough to be able to recover the system 7 years later. Usually, the old hardware will be senile or gone - but unless you've switched platforms, you can probably run the old stuff on the new platform, even 7 years later. But, you will need 'the old stuff'. So, the archive strategy must include backups of the software that runs the DBMS as well as the data from the database. You also need to ensure that your chunk device names can be recreated sufficiently well - so you need to know what devices are needed, and how big they must be, and so on. Consider whether you need to recover the entire O/S - or the tools on the O/S. Also, for long-term backups across platforms and versions, it may be sensible to create DB-Export style dumps of the data - you can recover that onto more recent versions of IDS. However, in the absence of compelling legal reasons, a shorter retention period is sensible, and 1-2 years is likely to be right. You still need to consider the backup of the relevant software. -- Jonathan Leffler #include <disclaimer.h> Email: jleffler@earthlink.net, jleffler@us.ibm.com Guardian of DBD::Informix v2008.0513 -- http://dbi.perl.org/ "Blessed are we who can laugh at ourselves, for we shall never cease to be amused." NB: Please do not use this email for correspondence. I don't necessarily read it every week, even. Marie von Ebner-Eschenbach<http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/m/marie_von_e bnereschenbac.html> - "Even a stopped clock is right twice a day." --000e0cd216b2419c020477b74798 ************************************************************************ ******* Forum Note: Use "Reply" to post a response in the discussion forum.