Re: Thinking Green.. yeah I know ... ironic... :-)
Not a technical problem thread at all — it's an opinion/marketing discussion. Starting from the claim that IDS is "green" because it scales and allows server consolidation (versus IBM's parallel 'green DB2' advertising), participants argue that IBM's Informix marketing is sporadic and lacks a cohesive, niche-focused campaign, and that recent announcements (e.g. encryption at IOD) don't differentiate IDS from DB2. One poster asks why IDS lacks DB2's disk compression, with the reply that features get added if customers request them. No problem resolution is recorded.
Auto-generated by DrWatson from the posts below — may be imperfect; read the full thread.
On Oct 28, 11:45 am, Obnoxio The Clown <obno...@serendipita.com> wrote: > Ian Michael Gumby wrote: > > > I think we're starting to see a backlash where the cheapest hourly > > solution provider doesn't necessarily mean the most cost effective > > solution provider. > > Something I've been saying for years ... (decades?!) > Yeah? Try selling IBM's Lab Services. Oh wait! I did that. :-) Its amazing how hard it is to convince a client that if they actually spent the $230+ an hour (USD) for a lab consultant for a two week engagement that they will actually save money. The only downside is when the client agrees to only one week and then is peeved that they can't extend the consultant because he/she is booked the following week at another client. But getting back to the concept of being green.... Yes, its an over used term that marketeers have made useless. The point is that with IDS, you can do more with less. Server consolidation is an example. Unlike its competitors IDS scales reasonably well.
In article <3fa1cd74-cb9c-4178-b244-fa6aa49d707a@s9g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, Ian Michael Gumby says... check the ads in Db2 mag. DB2 is being projected as a green database.
dcruncher4@aim.com wrote: > In article <3fa1cd74-cb9c-4178-b244-fa6aa49d707a@s9g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, > Ian Michael Gumby says... > > check the ads in Db2 mag. DB2 is being projected as a green database. I saw an advert that said that a Kia was a great car to drive. -- Cheers, Obnoxio The Clown http://obotheclown.blogspot.com
Wow. Green compared to what? Sure it may be greener to run a mainframe than a series of Microsoft Servers running SQL. SO yeah DB2 is the "greener" alternative. > From: dcruncher4@aim.com > Subject: Re: Thinking Green.. yeah I know ... ironic... :-) > Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2008 02:53:11 -0700 > To: informix-list@iiug.org > > In article <3fa1cd74-cb9c-4178-b244-fa6aa49d707a@s9g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, > Ian Michael Gumby says... > > check the ads in Db2 mag. DB2 is being projected as a green database. > > _______________________________________________ > Informix-list mailing list > Informix-list@iiug.org > http://www.iiug.org/mailman/listinfo/informix-list _________________________________________________________________ Stay organized with simple drag and drop from Windows Live Hotmail. http://windowslive.com/Explore/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_102008
Ian Michael Gumby wrote: > The point is that with IDS, you can do more with less. Server > consolidation is an example. Unlike its competitors IDS scales > reasonably well. > Let's shift outside the IDS box for just .02 quantums if you can. Indulge me. *<8o) <Ahem> <Cough> I have been watching the latest go-round of grenade-style marketing for IDS, where there are sudden small booms, but nothing afterward--more like a good M-80 going off. No real lasting impression other than the noise. Impressive to the eyes and ears but nothing material is produced. The current flock of messages are coming irregularly, prematurely, and always without fail, very weak. IBM's IOD was what, this past week, and nobody cares. Those viral videos that I've seen so far I wouldn't show to anyone, even my cat. _Most importantly, I think if you are going to have an actual marketing campaign, it has to reach outside the IBM box, and it has to reach out to the hottest markets out there. Markets that could actually give a crap about using and buying IDS._ _IDS_ needs to be of _HUGE INTEREST_, and it needs _HUGE APPEAL_. IDS has to be _HUGE_ in the minds of the public in order to create the momentum to make the sale. The marketing campaign does what no salesman or person can do, it creates product reality. Perception is... So the idea is to _get developers and businesses HUGELY interested in IDS_. _IDS_ needs to be marketed with _HUGE INTEREST AND APPEAL_. How do you do that? How do you create HUGE interest in a very TIGHT, crowded market that may seem HAIRY at times? I think the answer is that _YOU DO WHAT IT TAKES TO GET INTO THE MARKET_ , _PENETRATING AS DEEPLY AS POSSIBLE_ with as much momentum and energy as you can bring. There needs to be cash and prizes too for the developer community. If I were in the marketing department, yes, there would be _Informix Cheerleaders(tm)_ you could count on it. There would be stars and lights and great videos and promotions and press releases. Christmas is coming... *<8o)
InDeep wrote: > Ian Michael Gumby wrote: > >> The point is that with IDS, you can do more with less. Server >> consolidation is an example. Unlike its competitors IDS scales >> reasonably well. >> > > > Let's shift outside the IDS box for just .02 quantums if you can. > > Indulge me. *<8o) > > <Ahem> <Cough> > > I have been watching the latest go-round of grenade-style marketing for > IDS, where there are sudden small booms, but nothing afterward--more > like a good M-80 going off. No real lasting impression other than the > noise. Impressive to the eyes and ears but nothing material is produced. > > The current flock of messages are coming irregularly, prematurely, and > always without fail, very weak. IBM's IOD was what, this past week, and > nobody cares. Those viral videos that I've seen so far I wouldn't show > to anyone, even my cat. > > _Most importantly, I think if you are going to have an actual marketing > campaign, it has to reach outside the IBM box, and it has to reach out > to the hottest markets out there. Markets that could actually give a > crap about using and buying IDS._ > > _IDS_ needs to be of _HUGE INTEREST_, and it needs _HUGE APPEAL_. IDS > has to be _HUGE_ in the minds of the public in order to create the > momentum to make the sale. The marketing campaign does what no salesman > or person can do, it creates product reality. Perception is... > > So the idea is to _get developers and businesses HUGELY interested in > IDS_. _IDS_ needs to be marketed with _HUGE INTEREST AND APPEAL_. > > How do you do that? How do you create HUGE interest in a very TIGHT, > crowded market that may seem HAIRY at times? I think the answer is that > _YOU DO WHAT IT TAKES TO GET INTO THE MARKET_ , _PENETRATING AS DEEPLY > AS POSSIBLE_ with as much momentum and energy as you can bring. There > needs to be cash and prizes too for the developer community. > > If I were in the marketing department, yes, there would be _Informix > Cheerleaders(tm)_ you could count on it. There would be stars and > lights and great videos and promotions and press releases. > > Christmas is coming... It's not the only thing that's coming by the sound of it! -- Cheers, Obnoxio The Clown http://obotheclown.blogspot.com
On Oct 29, 10:07 am, InDeep <ind...@indeep.com> wrote: > Ian Michael Gumby wrote: > > The point is that with IDS, you can do more with less. Server > > consolidation is an example. Unlike its competitors IDS scales > > reasonably well. > > Let's shift outside the IDS box for just .02 quantums if you can. > > Indulge me. *<8o) > > <Ahem> <Cough> > [SNIP] To sum up ID's comment: IBM Informix marketing is spotting and not well tied together in to a package. There needs to be a cohesive and comprehensive push. Ok. I don't think anyone will disagree with that statement. Not even IBMers. :-) What we see at IOD is this new "encryption" solution which is marketed at both DB2 and IDS. In short. No product differential in latest announcements. Again, there's no shock there. It seems that IBM's IDS folks have been globe trotting and putting out fires and that there hasn't been a concerted effort to address the bigger picture. I'm sure there are some in IBM who would disagree with our statements and sentiment. But I do know that there are those within IBM who actually read what we say and maybe its starting to sink in. I disagree with your approach. Its the approach that Sun has been taking for the past year or so and of course look where Sun is today. I do agree that there has to be a niche play and a concerted effort. There also needs to be some minor tweaks in the engine too. But I digress... The point is that IBM IM IDS marketing (Hi Kathy!) needs to find a niche that they want to enter/own and create a compelling story. I know of one that might still work, but I don't know if IBM is willing to do what it takes to pull the trigger and make it happen. If they were, I'd be glad to talk one on one to certain people... ;-) But yeah, we can all bitch about their marketing.
On Oct 29, 10:35 am, Obnoxio The Clown <obno...@serendipita.com> wrote: > It's not the only thing that's coming by the sound of it! > Too much spicy green curry? > -- > Cheers, > Obnoxio The Clown > > http://obotheclown.blogspot.com
Michael, You are at IOD? I'd like to put a face to the sock puppet. Mark just got his DB2 shirt. I'm sure I find one for you as well. You can find me at "Meet The Experts" Thursday from 9:30-10:30 Cheers Serge -- Serge Rielau DB2 Solutions Development IBM Toronto Lab
On Oct 29, 8:42 pm, Serge Rielau <srie...@ca.ibm.com> wrote: > Michael, > > You are at IOD? I'd like to put a face to the sock puppet. > Mark just got his DB2 shirt. I'm sure I find one for you as well. > You can find me at "Meet The Experts" Thursday from 9:30-10:30 > > Cheers > Serge > Naw, I have this ankle bracelet which keeps me tied to the Chicago City Limits. ;-) I already have DB2 shirts, but I'd love some IBM IDS shirts (do they exist? ;-) Maybe you can drop them from your plane as you fly over Chicago back to Toronto. :-)
On 29 Oct, 15:58, Ian Michael Gumby <im_gu...@hotmail.com> wrote: > On Oct 29, 10:07 am, InDeep <ind...@indeep.com> wrote:> Ian Michael Gumby wrote: > > > The point is that with IDS, you can do more with less. Server > > > consolidation is an example. Unlike its competitors IDS scales > > > reasonably well. > > > Let's shift outside the IDS box for just .02 quantums if you can. > > > Indulge me. *<8o) > > > <Ahem> <Cough> > > [SNIP] > > To sum up ID's comment: IBM Informix marketing is spotting and not > well tied together in to a package. There needs to be a cohesive and > comprehensive push. > > Ok. I don't think anyone will disagree with that statement. Not even > IBMers. :-) > > What we see at IOD is this new "encryption" solution which is marketed > at both DB2 and IDS. In short. No product differential in latest > announcements. > Again, there's no shock there. Right and where is the http://www-01.ibm.com/software/data/db2/9/editions_features_storage.html (disk compression) for IDS then? > > It seems that IBM's IDS folks have been globe trotting and putting out > fires and that there hasn't been a concerted effort to address the > bigger picture. > I'm sure there are some in IBM who would disagree with our statements > and sentiment. > > But I do know that there are those within IBM who actually read what > we say and maybe its starting to sink in. > > I disagree with your approach. Its the approach that Sun has been > taking for the past year or so and of course look where Sun is today. > I do agree that there has to be a niche play and a concerted effort. > > There also needs to be some minor tweaks in the engine too. > But I digress... The point is that IBM IM IDS marketing (Hi Kathy!) > needs to find a niche that they want to enter/own and create a > compelling story. > I know of one that might still work, but I don't know if IBM is > willing to do what it takes to pull the trigger and make it happen. > If they were, I'd be glad to talk one on one to certain people... ;-) > > But yeah, we can all bitch about their marketing.
david@smooth1.co.uk wrote: > On 29 Oct, 15:58, Ian Michael Gumby <im_gu...@hotmail.com> wrote: >> On Oct 29, 10:07 am, InDeep <ind...@indeep.com> wrote:> Ian Michael Gumby wrote: >>>> The point is that with IDS, you can do more with less. Server >>>> consolidation is an example. Unlike its competitors IDS scales >>>> reasonably well. >>> Let's shift outside the IDS box for just .02 quantums if you can. >>> Indulge me. *<8o) >>> <Ahem> <Cough> >> [SNIP] >> >> To sum up ID's comment: IBM Informix marketing is spotting and not >> well tied together in to a package. There needs to be a cohesive and >> comprehensive push. >> >> Ok. I don't think anyone will disagree with that statement. Not even >> IBMers. :-) >> >> What we see at IOD is this new "encryption" solution which is marketed >> at both DB2 and IDS. In short. No product differential in latest >> announcements. >> Again, there's no shock there. > > Right and where is the http://www-01.ibm.com/software/data/db2/9/editions_features_storage.html > (disk compression) for IDS then? Well, you may as well ask where all the IDS features in DB2 are. I'm sure if enough people asked for it, they'd put it in. Did you ask for it? No, neither did I. -- Cheers, Obnoxio The Clown http://obotheclown.blogspot.com