Re: NEWERA THE END? --- does anyone care?

This is enough of a bombshell that IIUG should know and possibly take it up at their meetings with Informix. I have copied this post to Carlton Doe. (Look at the end for what was said.) Even if it where true that NewEra isn't the highest priority product at Informix (which it probably isn't) this isn't they way to do marketing. I don't use NewEra and have no current plans to do so (sorry Billy), but still this kind of statements both hurt me and can do major damage to Informix. They have significant customers using NewEra in different parts of the world. If this came to their attention Informix would have some serious damage control work to do. Such things will influence me as well. I will look dumb using and supporting Informix even in quite different customers eys. What this Jeff Hudson doesn't understand is that just a few deals involving NewEra could earn Informix more than enough long term to cover the development and maintenance costs of the product. One shouldn't forget that users are essentially locked in to Informix by using their tools for development. Many customer still see this as a very positive thing. Many would hardly buy a database without beeing able to get tools from the same supplier. This is not stupid, much less brain dead. We are going for Java. To Jeff Hudson's possible supprise though, we actually expect to become database independent at the same time. May be he realy want's that? We might decide to go for Informix Universal Server in case we can get it at a reasonable price on reasonable platforms (the big three Unix vendors are out of the question for price reasons alone, and NT isn't so great - hint hint - Linux and possibly SCO Unix would be a good idea). This might lock us in with Informix again, at least for some time. We don't realy mind that. I do think it important for Informix to open up both ways. They should cater equally well to customers who want to be database independent, as to those who don't mind a lock in with Informix if they can get a better product that way. Both are equally valid standpoints in different situations. A significant problem for Jeff Hudson and Informix is that there aren't realy that many development tools out there that can be used for major database developments. He mentions Visual Basic. Well it's nice for small client only applications. When it comes to major applications that also need server side programming it's not a viable solution unless you decide up front that Windows NT shall for ever be your only server option. He mentions Java. I happen to believe that Java is and will be a tool for major developments. There are now several large to very large systems beeing developed in Java, and it all looks good. There is however still troubled water ahead, and it will still be some time before it's tested enough for most purposes a database development tool is needed. He mentions no other. The reason is simply there are no other major tools for the great public. Yes there are Delphi, but essentially with the same limitations as Visual Basic (although it's clearly a better language). PowerBuilder have the same problems. Then there is Forte. To expensive, coming from a small company that feels the competition from Java. Then there are a pletora of tools from companies all over the world. All are relatively small however, generally very expensive, and not an option for many. NewEra was actually allways cheaper than most of these, and now with better functionality than most. Last there is C or C++. In the database development arena these are a loosing proposition. If you develop an OS, a database engine or even a word processor or similar tools there is hardly any way arround C. It simply takes too long to create finished database type applications with these alone. Many excelent database programmers whould hardly be able to start at all. Last, but not least, there are the tools from that other database vendor. They may not be so great, but many customers want something like that and the lock in is perfect more or less for ever. With other words, the main competition is from VB/Delphi/Powerbuilder at the low end, who all lack the all important capability of handling large amounts of data fast. That problem can hardly be solved on Unix servers at least. At the high end is Forte and a few other tools that are generally far to expensive for many customers. The only other thing I can see around is actually Java if you don't want the other vendors locked in tools. Doesn't Informix understand that now, with NewEra more or less grown up they can probably be maintained it, and even enhanced it with new versions, with a relatively small team of developers. In this situation the time might be right to actually push it a little. If I where Informix I would have started pushing it by setting the price to say US$ 495 with no runtime price at all. Upgrades at perhaps 50 to 75% of that. I wouldn't expect to earn all that much on this sales alone. Do think however what would happen when a few thousand, or some 10th of thousands developers started churning out applications. May be Informix would see some more engine sales? It shouldn't even be all that hard to record it in their sales tracking system so they could later look at the economic results of this. Also as little as 10000 NewEra licenses sold a year would yeald about US$ 5 mill at this price. Possibly enough to support a few developers all by itself. Even Tim's idea of making it downloadable from the web may be good. They should probably still charge for commercial use licenses, but people could at least easily test it. No I am totally at a loss to understand what is going on with NewEra. Mike Ripley <mike.ripley@excelsys.co.uk> wrote: :Marco Greco said :- :"New Era a scaling down casualty? If I were a New Era user (which I'm :not, luckily) I would be downright outraged, like I was back when it was :4gl turn. :Breach of contract that is, no less." : :I am a NEWERA user and I am beginning to wonder if I have been through a :time warp. :Did Mr Jeff Hudson, (Informix vice president of corporate development) :actually say "You have to be brain dead to think that a database company :also needs its own proper tools for the database"? : :This appears to be an absolute bomb shell! : :Judging by the negligible reaction I have seen on the net, I now realise :that we were after all the only NEWERA user. : :P.S. What tools do you recommend? Do we go with Java or Visual Basic as :recommended by Mr Hudson? But then again how sound is his judgement? : :-- :Mike Ripley Based on this post: Tim <tim.simpson@excelsys.co.uk> wrote: :Hi : :October 97 issue of Computing has the following quote from Jeff Hudson:- : :"Among the casualties of the scaling down, as well as people, will be :the object-orientated development tool, NewEra." : :Hudson also had some bad news for NewEra customers: there will be no new :versions of the OO development tool. : :"..you have to be brain dead to think that a database company also needs :its own proper tools for the database. Java and Visual Basic have become