11.5 Stability ?
A user asked whether IDS 11.50.FC1 was stable enough for production, given the traditional habit of waiting for a few fixpacks. No bug reports or definitive answer emerged; the consensus advice was general: avoid any vendor's first release in mission-critical systems, test thoroughly in your own environment, and watch IBM bug alerts and Fix Central, including cumulative Post Interim Drops (e.g. 11.50.FC1W1) that may appear before FC2. Contributors also noted that fixes are cross-checked across 9.x/10/11.10/11.50 families, that 11.10 would likely get few further fixpacks though still supported under its lifecycle dates, and that 11.50 is believed to be 11.10 plus new features rather than a code rewrite. No formal resolution is recorded.
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So when is 11.5 Stable enough to use? Perhaps that should read - When is 11.5 stable enough to feel safe to use. Knowing a bit about the bugs in early versions, I'm wondering how 11.5 is shaping up? Normally I'd say something like XC3 or greater - Maybe IBM should release 3 fp's in the first month so people take it up, similar to how they confuse you with DB2 fp/version numbering. I guess you could go down the path of install on a dev system and see if anything breaks badly. Just wondered thoughts & experiences of peoples here. i.e. if your not a 24x7 mission critical bank using strange datatypes and new features then it's fine to try at FC1. TIA.
PeterP wrote: > So when is 11.5 Stable enough to use? > > Perhaps that should read - When is 11.5 stable enough to feel safe to > use. > Knowing a bit about the bugs in early versions, I'm wondering how 11.5 > is shaping up? Normally I'd say something like XC3 or greater - Maybe > IBM should release 3 fp's in the first month so people take it up, > similar to how they confuse you with DB2 fp/version numbering. > > I guess you could go down the path of install on a dev system and see > if anything breaks badly. Just wondered thoughts & experiences of > peoples here. > i.e. if your not a 24x7 mission critical bank using strange datatypes > and new features then it's fine to try at FC1. > > TIA. I will not talk specifically about 11.50.FC1. But as a general rule, I would avoid using an early version in a production mission critical system... Not only Informix, but any other software in the world. Specially when it contains new features. In any case, there were good FC1 versions and bad FC1 versions... There were historically bad FC* versions also... The main principle should be the same for any version: Test it as much as you can in your environment... All versions have bugs. Some of them are nasty, others are "cosmetic", and many of them are transparent if you're lucky enough to not use the feature or not hit the conditions that make them visible... That said, I have no knowledge of any nasty bug with 11.50, but this may be just because not many people are using it... It was launched just a month ago, so possibly nobody is using it in critical systems... One good point that may not be obvious for the customers: When IBM finds a bug in one of the families (9.x, 10.x, 11.10, 11.5) the bug is tested against the other versions. So, it's correct to assume that 11.5 includes fixes done in late 11.1 and 10 for example. Obviously, due to product launch and code freezing, possibly not all of them were applied. My advice: Test it, check the bug alerts and other IBM notes. Besides, there are a number of new features that should keep you busy for some weeks in order to get used to them. Regards
On Tue, Jun 10, 2008 at 5:51 AM, Fernando Nunes <domusonline@gmail.com> wrote: > PeterP wrote: >> So when is 11.5 Stable enough to use? >> >> Perhaps that should read - When is 11.5 stable enough to feel safe to >> use. >> Knowing a bit about the bugs in early versions, I'm wondering how 11.5 >> is shaping up? Normally I'd say something like XC3 or greater - Maybe >> IBM should release 3 fp's in the first month so people take it up, >> similar to how they confuse you with DB2 fp/version numbering. >> >> I guess you could go down the path of install on a dev system and see >> if anything breaks badly. Just wondered thoughts & experiences of >> peoples here. >> i.e. if your not a 24x7 mission critical bank using strange datatypes >> and new features then it's fine to try at FC1. >> >> TIA. > > I will not talk specifically about 11.50.FC1. But as a general rule, I would > avoid using an early version in a production mission critical system... Not > only Informix, but any other software in the world. Specially when it contains > new features. > In any case, there were good FC1 versions and bad FC1 versions... There were > historically bad FC* versions also... The main principle should be the same for > any version: Test it as much as you can in your environment... All versions > have bugs. Some of them are nasty, others are "cosmetic", and many of them are > transparent if you're lucky enough to not use the feature or not hit the > conditions that make them visible... > > That said, I have no knowledge of any nasty bug with 11.50, but this may be > just because not many people are using it... It was launched just a month ago, > so possibly nobody is using it in critical systems... > One good point that may not be obvious for the customers: When IBM finds a bug > in one of the families (9.x, 10.x, 11.10, 11.5) the bug is tested against the > other versions. So, it's correct to assume that 11.5 includes fixes done in > late 11.1 and 10 for example. Obviously, due to product launch and code > freezing, possibly not all of them were applied. > > My advice: Test it, check the bug alerts and other IBM notes. Besides, there > are a number of new features that should keep you busy for some weeks in order > to get used to them. > > Regards > _______________________________________________ > Informix-list mailing list > Informix-list@iiug.org > http://www.iiug.org/mailman/listinfo/informix-list > It is increasingly difficult to use the methodology of waiting for a couple of fixpacks before adopting a new release. For instance there was not a lot of time from when version 10 that version 11.1 was released (at least when you look back at Informix' history). And now version 11.5 comes out when version 11.1 was barely out of the door and it is my understanding that the 11.1 line will not continue, so anyone looking to upgrade to version 11 should be testing 11.5 instead. As for myself, I'll be following Fernando's advice.
Jim Tranny wrote: > On Tue, Jun 10, 2008 at 5:51 AM, Fernando Nunes <domusonline@gmail.com> wrote: >> PeterP wrote: >>> So when is 11.5 Stable enough to use? >>> >>> Perhaps that should read - When is 11.5 stable enough to feel safe to >>> use. >>> Knowing a bit about the bugs in early versions, I'm wondering how 11.5 >>> is shaping up? Normally I'd say something like XC3 or greater - Maybe >>> IBM should release 3 fp's in the first month so people take it up, >>> similar to how they confuse you with DB2 fp/version numbering. >>> >>> I guess you could go down the path of install on a dev system and see >>> if anything breaks badly. Just wondered thoughts & experiences of >>> peoples here. >>> i.e. if your not a 24x7 mission critical bank using strange datatypes >>> and new features then it's fine to try at FC1. >>> >>> TIA. >> I will not talk specifically about 11.50.FC1. But as a general rule, I would >> avoid using an early version in a production mission critical system... Not >> only Informix, but any other software in the world. Specially when it contains >> new features. >> In any case, there were good FC1 versions and bad FC1 versions... There were >> historically bad FC* versions also... The main principle should be the same for >> any version: Test it as much as you can in your environment... All versions >> have bugs. Some of them are nasty, others are "cosmetic", and many of them are >> transparent if you're lucky enough to not use the feature or not hit the >> conditions that make them visible... >> >> That said, I have no knowledge of any nasty bug with 11.50, but this may be >> just because not many people are using it... It was launched just a month ago, >> so possibly nobody is using it in critical systems... >> One good point that may not be obvious for the customers: When IBM finds a bug >> in one of the families (9.x, 10.x, 11.10, 11.5) the bug is tested against the >> other versions. So, it's correct to assume that 11.5 includes fixes done in >> late 11.1 and 10 for example. Obviously, due to product launch and code >> freezing, possibly not all of them were applied. >> >> My advice: Test it, check the bug alerts and other IBM notes. Besides, there >> are a number of new features that should keep you busy for some weeks in order >> to get used to them. >> >> Regards >> _______________________________________________ >> Informix-list mailing list >> Informix-list@iiug.org >> http://www.iiug.org/mailman/listinfo/informix-list >> > > It is increasingly difficult to use the methodology of waiting for a > couple of fixpacks before adopting a new release. For instance there > was not a lot of time from when version 10 that version 11.1 was > released (at least when you look back at Informix' history). And now > version 11.5 comes out when version 11.1 was barely out of the door > and it is my understanding that the 11.1 line will not continue, so > anyone looking to upgrade to version 11 should be testing 11.5 > instead. > > As for myself, I'll be following Fernando's advice. Well, that was true for 11.10. Not so for 10. 10 is currently at FC8 which is a reasonable number of fixpacks. The 11.10 -> 11.50 cycle was in fact very short (only one year). The fact is that there were features too important to appear in a 11.10 FC3/FC4... Let's wait and see, but it's possible tat newer versions take a little longer. Meanwhile for customers using the main platforms, don't forget the PID (Post Interim Drops), identifiable by major.minor.F*W*... These Ws include *cumulative* fixes. I personally think think brings great value for customers. And this decreases the need to build specific patches (major.minor.F*X*), so it's also good for IBM. So, it's possible we see a 11.50.FC1W1 before a 11.50.FC2. Keep an eye on FixCentral. Regards
On Jun 10, 11:36 pm, Fernando Nunes <domusonl...@gmail.com> wrote: > Jim Tranny wrote: > > On Tue, Jun 10, 2008 at 5:51 AM, Fernando Nunes <domusonl...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> PeterP wrote: > >>> So when is 11.5 Stable enough to use? > > >>> Perhaps that should read - When is 11.5 stable enough to feel safe to > >>> use. > >>> Knowing a bit about the bugs in early versions, I'm wondering how 11.5 > >>> is shaping up? Normally I'd say something like XC3 or greater - Maybe > >>> IBM should release 3 fp's in the first month so people take it up, > >>> similar to how they confuse you with DB2 fp/version numbering. > > >>> I guess you could go down the path of install on a dev system and see > >>> if anything breaks badly. Just wondered thoughts & experiences of > >>> peoples here. > >>> i.e. if your not a 24x7 mission critical bank using strange datatypes > >>> and new features then it's fine to try at FC1. > > >>> TIA. > >> I will not talk specifically about 11.50.FC1. But as a general rule, I would > >> avoid using an early version in a production mission critical system... Not > >> only Informix, but any other software in the world. Specially when it contains > >> new features. > >> In any case, there were good FC1 versions and bad FC1 versions... There were > >> historically bad FC* versions also... The main principle should be the same for > >> any version: Test it as much as you can in your environment... All versions > >> have bugs. Some of them are nasty, others are "cosmetic", and many of them are > >> transparent if you're lucky enough to not use the feature or not hit the > >> conditions that make them visible... > > >> That said, I have no knowledge of any nasty bug with 11.50, but this may be > >> just because not many people are using it... It was launched just a month ago, > >> so possibly nobody is using it in critical systems... > >> One good point that may not be obvious for the customers: When IBM finds a bug > >> in one of the families (9.x, 10.x, 11.10, 11.5) the bug is tested against the > >> other versions. So, it's correct to assume that 11.5 includes fixes done in > >> late 11.1 and 10 for example. Obviously, due to product launch and code > >> freezing, possibly not all of them were applied. > > >> My advice: Test it, check the bug alerts and other IBM notes. Besides, there > >> are a number of new features that should keep you busy for some weeks in order > >> to get used to them. > > >> Regards > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Informix-list mailing list > >> Informix-l...@iiug.org > >>http://www.iiug.org/mailman/listinfo/informix-list > > > It is increasingly difficult to use the methodology of waiting for a > > couple of fixpacks before adopting a new release. For instance there > > was not a lot of time from when version 10 that version 11.1 was > > released (at least when you look back at Informix' history). And now > > version 11.5 comes out when version 11.1 was barely out of the door > > and it is my understanding that the 11.1 line will not continue, so > > anyone looking to upgrade to version 11 should be testing 11.5 > > instead. > > > As for myself, I'll be following Fernando's advice. > > Well, that was true for 11.10. Not so for 10. 10 is currently at FC8 which is a > reasonable number of fixpacks. The 11.10 -> 11.50 cycle was in fact very short > (only one year). The fact is that there were features too important to appear > in a 11.10 FC3/FC4... Let's wait and see, but it's possible tat newer versions > take a little longer. Meanwhile for customers using the main platforms, don't > forget the PID (Post Interim Drops), identifiable by major.minor.F*W*... These > Ws include *cumulative* fixes. I personally think think brings great value for > customers. And this decreases the need to build specific patches > (major.minor.F*X*), so it's also good for IBM. > So, it's possible we see a 11.50.FC1W1 before a 11.50.FC2. Keep an eye on > FixCentral. > > Regards- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - Fernando, that is excellent advice in your first post. Jim, where did you get V11.1 will not be around much longer? IBM seems to be saying it's the one that'll be around the longest Looking at the PLC page - http://www-306.ibm.com/software/data/support/lifecycle/ And policy type (Standard and Extended) - http://www-306.ibm.com/software/support/lifecycle/lc-policy.html V9.40 - 30.04.2008 V10.0 - 30.09.2010 V11.1 - 30.09.2012 - Due to extended policy 5yrs V11.5 - 30.09.2011 - Assuming the 3 yr policy rule So if you don't need the 11.5 features, at the moment, 11.1 is going to be around longer? Very strange but an assumption based on a policy. Does anyone know how the code is branched for 11.5? Is it 11.1 + the new features or are there major re-writes in all areas of the code. And how is 11.1 Different from 10 which is fairly stable. I'm sorry if thats not very clear I'm after more of an engineering answer. Is 11.5 really 11.1.FC4 but had new features so it got called Cheetah 2. If thats not the case, then how come IBM is maintaining so many code lines particularly by including V11.1 in the extended policy? Seemingly (and this is not necessarily a bad thing), the model for running Informix is following DB2 in that you get the latest version and apply the fixpack and if you hit a bug, and if it was a bad one it'll be coded soon and you just have to wear it. This is helpful I suppose by forcing people off of old versions so that you don't end up on 9.4 trying to compete against SQL server 2008 (new vs old products).
PeterP wrote: > On Jun 10, 11:36 pm, Fernando Nunes <domusonl...@gmail.com> wrote: >> Jim Tranny wrote: >>> On Tue, Jun 10, 2008 at 5:51 AM, Fernando Nunes <domusonl...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> PeterP wrote: >>>>> So when is 11.5 Stable enough to use? >>>>> Perhaps that should read - When is 11.5 stable enough to feel safe to >>>>> use. >>>>> Knowing a bit about the bugs in early versions, I'm wondering how 11.5 >>>>> is shaping up? Normally I'd say something like XC3 or greater - Maybe >>>>> IBM should release 3 fp's in the first month so people take it up, >>>>> similar to how they confuse you with DB2 fp/version numbering. >>>>> I guess you could go down the path of install on a dev system and see >>>>> if anything breaks badly. Just wondered thoughts & experiences of >>>>> peoples here. >>>>> i.e. if your not a 24x7 mission critical bank using strange datatypes >>>>> and new features then it's fine to try at FC1. >>>>> TIA. >>>> I will not talk specifically about 11.50.FC1. But as a general rule, I would >>>> avoid using an early version in a production mission critical system... Not >>>> only Informix, but any other software in the world. Specially when it contains >>>> new features. >>>> In any case, there were good FC1 versions and bad FC1 versions... There were >>>> historically bad FC* versions also... The main principle should be the same for >>>> any version: Test it as much as you can in your environment... All versions >>>> have bugs. Some of them are nasty, others are "cosmetic", and many of them are >>>> transparent if you're lucky enough to not use the feature or not hit the >>>> conditions that make them visible... >>>> That said, I have no knowledge of any nasty bug with 11.50, but this may be >>>> just because not many people are using it... It was launched just a month ago, >>>> so possibly nobody is using it in critical systems... >>>> One good point that may not be obvious for the customers: When IBM finds a bug >>>> in one of the families (9.x, 10.x, 11.10, 11.5) the bug is tested against the >>>> other versions. So, it's correct to assume that 11.5 includes fixes done in >>>> late 11.1 and 10 for example. Obviously, due to product launch and code >>>> freezing, possibly not all of them were applied. >>>> My advice: Test it, check the bug alerts and other IBM notes. Besides, there >>>> are a number of new features that should keep you busy for some weeks in order >>>> to get used to them. >>>> Regards >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Informix-list mailing list >>>> Informix-l...@iiug.org >>>> http://www.iiug.org/mailman/listinfo/informix-list >>> It is increasingly difficult to use the methodology of waiting for a >>> couple of fixpacks before adopting a new release. For instance there >>> was not a lot of time from when version 10 that version 11.1 was >>> released (at least when you look back at Informix' history). And now >>> version 11.5 comes out when version 11.1 was barely out of the door >>> and it is my understanding that the 11.1 line will not continue, so >>> anyone looking to upgrade to version 11 should be testing 11.5 >>> instead. >>> As for myself, I'll be following Fernando's advice. >> Well, that was true for 11.10. Not so for 10. 10 is currently at FC8 which is a >> reasonable number of fixpacks. The 11.10 -> 11.50 cycle was in fact very short >> (only one year). The fact is that there were features too important to appear >> in a 11.10 FC3/FC4... Let's wait and see, but it's possible tat newer versions >> take a little longer. Meanwhile for customers using the main platforms, don't >> forget the PID (Post Interim Drops), identifiable by major.minor.F*W*... These >> Ws include *cumulative* fixes. I personally think think brings great value for >> customers. And this decreases the need to build specific patches >> (major.minor.F*X*), so it's also good for IBM. >> So, it's possible we see a 11.50.FC1W1 before a 11.50.FC2. Keep an eye on >> FixCentral. >> >> Regards- Hide quoted text - >> >> - Show quoted text - > > Fernando, that is excellent advice in your first post. > > Jim, where did you get V11.1 will not be around much longer? IBM seems > to be saying it's the one that'll be around the longest > > Looking at the PLC page - http://www-306.ibm.com/software/data/support/lifecycle/ > And policy type (Standard and Extended) - > http://www-306.ibm.com/software/support/lifecycle/lc-policy.html > > V9.40 - 30.04.2008 > V10.0 - 30.09.2010 > V11.1 - 30.09.2012 - Due to extended policy 5yrs > V11.5 - 30.09.2011 - Assuming the 3 yr policy rule > > So if you don't need the 11.5 features, at the moment, 11.1 is going > to be around longer? Very strange but an assumption based on a policy. I think that what Jim was saying is that we won't see much more 11.10.FC* versions... Not that it will be unsupported. > Does anyone know how the code is branched for 11.5? Is it 11.1 + the > new features or are there major re-writes in all areas of the code. > And how is 11.1 Different from 10 which is fairly stable. I'm sorry if > thats not very clear I'm after more of an engineering answer. > Is 11.5 really 11.1.FC4 but had new features so it got called Cheetah > 2. If thats not the case, then how come IBM is maintaining so many > code lines particularly by including V11.1 in the extended policy? I can't speak for the development/IBM, but AFAIK, IDS 11.5 is not a code re-write. It's based on 11.10 with new features. This is not an Engineering answer of course. But what I mean is that 11.10 and 11.50 share most of the code as far as I can tell and with all the disclaimers applied... Regards.