Re: Yahoo - Informix Revitalizes 4GL Application Development Too

On 8 May 98 at 12:20, Mark D. Stock wrote: > Billy Wheeler wrote: > > > > On 8 May 98 at 11:44, Mark D. Stock wrote: > > > > > Billy Wheeler wrote: > > > > > > > > On 7 May 98 at 11:58, Ing. Melvin Perez Cedano wrote: > > > > > > > > > Mark D. Stock wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Ing. Melvin Perez Cedano wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > any comments? > > > > > > > > Oh, I have plenty. How about the way my NewEra customers regard me, > > > > thanks to selling them a "brain-dead" tool? How about what do we do > > > > with our millions of lines of 4GL code? Etc. > > > > > > Now there's a turn-around. I thought you said it was a great tool? > > > > What, 4GL? Sure it's a great tool. But The Market (TM) sees it as > > dead, new entrants to the programming market don't want to learn it, > > Informix are not doing anything to push it into, uh, a new era... > > This is all nearer the truth, but you were referring to NewEra as a > 'brain-dead' tool. *I* didn't. It was a guy called Jeff Hudson from Informix who said that. Publicly. And made it impossible to defend or market NewEra. > > > > > > > Informix, is now when you realize that there's a big market using > > > > > > > INFORMIX-4GL waiting for a real solution for migrating to new > > > > > > > environments (client/server, intranet)? > > > > > > > > > > > > I think the realisation that 4GL had a big market came a few years ago. > > > > > > > > I don't know about that. I think they've conveniently forgotten the > > > > fact. > > > > > > So why continue to support the product? Why not sell it off, like so > > > many before? Maybe I should keep quite, things have a nasty habit of > > > turning around. ;-) > > > > Beats me. But supporting the product is *not* the same as enhancing > > it to make it competitive in the market. > > If you're talking about 4GL, then we're going in circles. If you're > talking about NewEra, then I agree. But that was what Bob decided, > and he DOES run the company. ;-) Ah. Well, to a certain extent, we are going round in circles. But my comments apply to both 4GL and Newera. And I think that since Bob does run the company, he needs to consider some way of taking existing customers forward to new technogies. > > > > > INFORMIX realized that is a database company, not a tool one!! but, > > > > > what about those thousand of INFORMIX-4GL users? > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, I'm still being a real Informixer! > > > > > > > > > > > > Mmmm, that's one term, there are others. :-) > > > > > > > > What, you don't think that it's right for an Informix user to > > > > criticise Informix for leaving him in a dead end with some of his > > > > Informix products? > > > > > > No I don't. But what dead end? If you need a character based > > > application, I still think 4GL is the way to go. As I said before, > > > if your requirements have changed, then you have to look at the > > > easiest way of migrating to your desired environment, GUI or > > > whatever. In this area there is certainly a void, but products like > > > 4Js and SuperNova are out there. Whether you like the end result is > > > up to you. > > > > I think the point Melvin and I are trying to make is that if a third > > party can migrate your applications into, uh, a new era, why couldn't > > Informix do it. Why was it left to third-party vendors to do it? Some > > of us enjoy dealing with Informix and had good experiences with and > > loyalty to Informix's tool strategy. Why were "we" left in the lurch? > > Well I think the crux of the matter at that point in time was that > Informix was busy going under. Before that, NewEra was seen as the, > er, new era. Since then, third-party tools have appeared, so why > re-invent the wheel. If there was spare cash, Informix could have > bought these products. Um. Third-party tools were developed subsequent to 4GL, that didn't stop Informix from making lots of money out of the product and tying a lot of people into it. > "Left in the lurch" is probably a bit strong, but for answers there, > you'll have to speak to Bob. ;-) So, where is he? I don't think that "left in the lurch" is a bit strong: people who bought NewEra are in a difficult, near-impossible situation, people who bought 4GL have no Informix-based strategy to protect their investment in code. Anyway, maybe someone should forward this thread to Bob and see what he says. It is apparent to me that little will be achieved by discussing it here, other than to relieve some frustration.... :-) -- Ciao, Billy /Group Managing Director, The West Solutions Group: http://www.west.co.za \\ Drivel @ http://www.west.co.za/tasteless/ / \\ "Granted, Mr Wheeler's ideas are stupid and unreasonable, but he does own the company and I / think we should go along with him..." \\________________________________________________________________________________________________