RE: Insider #75: Highlights: IBM Information On Demand 2006, The Next Informix IDS Release...
C'on Keith -- there are also a few bridges in Vienna, and they are very nicely located near the conference center... I am not too keen on camping, but, you are not forced to pay 600€ per night (assuming you stay three night, mon, tue, wed), the conference hotel is not even a third of this price. Seriously, we realize it is expensive, but it's an investment. When your shop requires an expert to come and solve a problem, it may be 1000 euros or more per day, plus the same expenses... The debate is over for Vienna but open for future conferences... > -----Original Message----- > From: informix-list-bounces@iiug.org [mailto:informix-list- > bounces@iiug.org] On Behalf Of Keith Simmons > Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 12:25 > To: informix-list > Subject: Fwd: Insider #75: Highlights: IBM Information On Demand 2006,The > Next Informix IDS Release... > > And another 1800 euros for room only accomodation, the price just > racks up and up > > On 01/10/06, Captain Pedantic <theharlequin36@hotmail.com> wrote: > > >> One unnamed customer runs 4,000 physical locations and more than > 10,000 > > >> instances of the current IDS release with just eight DBAs, he > claimed. > > >> "If you can show me an Oracle installation [doing that], I'll buy you > the > > >> bottle of wine of your choice," he said. > > > > Why is the customer un-named? > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Informix-list mailing list > > Informix-list@iiug.org > > http://www.iiug.org/mailman/listinfo/informix-list > > > _______________________________________________ > Informix-list mailing list > Informix-list@iiug.org > http://www.iiug.org/mailman/listinfo/informix-list
> Seriously, we realize it is expensive, but it's an investment. An investment? Who is supposed to come to Vienna? End-users who are using Informix and Business Partners who are supporting them doing that. Well, end-users already made an investement purchasing licenses. BP's should invest so they can sell IBM's software? Should not it be the other way around? IBM enabling BP's for successfull sales and tech support?
Davorin Kremenjas said: >> Seriously, we realize it is expensive, but it's an investment. > > An investment? > Who is supposed to come to Vienna? End-users who are using Informix and > Business Partners who are supporting them doing that. > Well, end-users already made an investement purchasing licenses. > BP's should invest so they can sell IBM's software? Should not it be the > other way around? IBM enabling BP's for successfull sales and tech > support? Yeah, why should end-users invest in education, seriously? I mean, you have the cream of IBM's Informix experts in one venue, people who design and build vital components of IDS who can teach you about new, cutting-edge and undocumented features. You have users who have already done stuff you will be doing and can teach you what to look out for. Why should you pay to listen to them teach you how to make use of your databases? Why should you have to contribute to the bill for facilities? For that matter, why should you even bother to read the manuals? For the sake of fucking fuck, yes, this conference IS expensive, but what the do you moaning minnies all want? Either you have to get off your arses and put together all the conference material, badger your employers to donate education facilities and cajole local experts to present on them (like the WAIUG forum) and make a cheap and interesting conference, or you can pay someone to do all the drudge work for you (like the IDUG/IIUG EMEA conference). And for years now, I've been hearing sniping about how the IIUG are biased towards America, and how they never do anything for Europe, and how unfair they all are. Now there's a conference right in the heart of Europe and they are still being pilloried. Have you guys who are all bitching about this conference actually done anything constructive to show the IIUG what could be done for less money? I had a look at the list of speakers and I wish I could have afforded to go myself. But I can't and I don't sit here and whinge about how insensitive the IIUG are for charging money for high-quality speakers in an expensive venue. At the end of the day, you pay for your education one way or another. And what is cheaper: 2000 Euros to learn from the best on a wide variety of topics, 2000 Euros for a good IBM class on one topic (times however many topics you need to cover), or days of downtime or lost business opportunities because you didn't know better? And while I'm already fucking pissed off: I've been involved in Informix User Groups on three continents, and the bulk of the user communities on all three were exactly the same bunch of indolent slackers who each wanted the conferences presented in THEIR company canteen, with a free lunch thrown in, with world class speakers, for free. And if it couldn't be in THEIR company canteen, they wanted a free chauffeur-driven limousine to pick them up at their front door and drop them off back at home as well. The handful of gung-ho members in each country would then bust their balls to try to deliver this, but there are always still moans: Oh, it's so far from London to Warwick! Oh, why is the conference in Dubai -- it's so far from Qatar!? Oh, I can't get management approval for a Tube ticket at lunch time for a seminar. Oh, I can't get the day off, why can't you reschedule the whole conference? Why can't you schedule the conference on a day when I don't have yoga classes? Oh, I didn't like the food, their was no lobster thermidore. For God's sake, get a grip. Instead of moaning, why the hell are you bastards never there when a conference is being organised? Why is it always down to committee members and IBM to do all the legwork, provide the speakers and all the facilities and refreshments? In fact, why are you bastards never there when it comes to forming and inevitably re-forming the latest incarnation of the local user group committee? I think the phrase "ungrateful bastards" sums up my years of working in the Informix user group community. Apart from the same handful of familiar faces, all this loyalty to and enthusiasm for the product seems to disappear when it comes to giving something back. Go on, prove me wrong. -- Yours in genuine and heartfelt anger, Obnoxio "... no bill is required as no value was provided." -- Christine Normile -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by OpenProtect(http://www.openprotect.com), and is believed to be clean.
"Obnoxio The Clown" <obnoxio@serendipita.com> wrote in message news:mailman.11.1159863143.29455.informix-list@iiug.org... > I had a look at the list of speakers and I wish I could have afforded to > go myself. But I can't and I don't sit here and whinge about how > insensitive the IIUG are for charging money for high-quality speakers in > an expensive venue. To be fair, JGP (or was it Gary?) said that he was disappointed with the level of registration and asked for feedback on why. I said I thought it was too expensive. JGP disagreed. Davorin disagreed with him. You seem to have adopted the astonishingly flexible position of blasting those who say it's too expensive whilst simultaneously admitting you're not going because it's too expensive!
Neil Truby said: > "Obnoxio The Clown" <obnoxio@serendipita.com> wrote in message > news:mailman.11.1159863143.29455.informix-list@iiug.org... > >> I had a look at the list of speakers and I wish I could have afforded to >> go myself. But I can't and I don't sit here and whinge about how >> insensitive the IIUG are for charging money for high-quality speakers in >> an expensive venue. > > To be fair, JGP (or was it Gary?) said that he was disappointed with the > level of registration and asked for feedback on why. I said I thought it > was too expensive. JGP disagreed. Davorin disagreed with him. > > You seem to have adopted the astonishingly flexible position of blasting > those who say it's too expensive whilst simultaneously admitting you're > not > going because it's too expensive! Actually, if you actually read my post you would have noticed that I was blasting people for the following: 1. Moaning that they had to pay for education; 2. Moaning that the IIUG never did anything in Europe and then moaning for what they did do when they did it; 3. Moaning that there was always something wrong with the education offered by the IIUG and other local user groups yet not having the gumption to get involved and contribute something themselves. If users were actually prepared to contribute by preparing material, coercing THEIR employers into providing facilities and refreshments and then deliver the material, then a user group conference can be provided at a much more acceptable rate. However, if everything has to be parachuted in, it will cost much more to attend. There is no logical inconsistency or flexibility in my position: I have given enough of my time and effort over 20 years to say that I have done what I can to help user groups provide something useful for users. I have done my bit. Can all the people bitching here about the cost of this event say the same? -- Bye now, Obnoxio "... no bill is required as no value was provided." -- Christine Normile -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by OpenProtect(http://www.openprotect.com), and is believed to be clean.