Re: Looks Like The Party Is Over In Menlo (2nd try)

From: "smooth1" <smooth1@iclway.co.uk> > >Obnoxio The Clown wrote in message <8n8ddm$8g6$1@news.xmission.com>... > >> Hence, my backups are corrupt, I can't handle crashes, kill errant > >> users and I won't know about corruption until someone spots > >> that the system is producing crap data (if this gets spotted at >all!). > >> > >> SE is out of data in terms of data integrity and should be dropped > >> in favour of IDS Workgroup Edition. > > > >That's all fine and dandy, David, but what about small sites who can't > >afford a DBA and just want a simple database platform? > > > > Why does online need a DBA? You can > > automate start and shutdown > automate backups with onbar and ISM. And you can automate the price difference, too? Is there anybody out there, please tell me if there is, who has a totally hands off IDS instance? I've *never* seen one, and I've seen plenty of IDS sites, believe me. > If online panics then that is only to stop data corruption. > > Are you saying it is ok for your customer to have undetected > corrupt data? Oh, come on, David. > Please let me know the names of the customer for whom this is ok > and I'll pass onto them the good news. OK, smarty pants. Now they have an AF. Now what do they do? And how long will they be down for without an inhouse DBA? ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com

Obnoxio The Clown wrote in message <8nb3in$qb4$1@news.xmission.com>... > >From: "smooth1" <smooth1@iclway.co.uk> >> >>Obnoxio The Clown wrote in message <8n8ddm$8g6$1@news.xmission.com>... >> >> Hence, my backups are corrupt, I can't handle crashes, kill errant >> >> users and I won't know about corruption until someone spots >> >> that the system is producing crap data (if this gets spotted at >>all!). >> >> >> >> SE is out of data in terms of data integrity and should be dropped >> >> in favour of IDS Workgroup Edition. >> > >> >That's all fine and dandy, David, but what about small sites who can't >> >afford a DBA and just want a simple database platform? >> > >> >> Why does online need a DBA? You can >> >> automate start and shutdown >> automate backups with onbar and ISM. > >And you can automate the price difference, too? Is there anybody out there, >please tell me if there is, who has a totally hands off IDS instance? I've >*never* seen one, and I've seen plenty of IDS sites, believe me. > >> If online panics then that is only to stop data corruption. >> >> Are you saying it is ok for your customer to have undetected >> corrupt data? > >Oh, come on, David. > Come on? I have seen this happen several times. Just ask a collegue who I left repairing a SE database at 6pm and who called me at home at 4am to say our servers were rebooting for backups and he was losing his connection to the customer! >> Please let me know the names of the customer for whom this is ok >> and I'll pass onto them the good news. > >OK, smarty pants. Now they have an AF. Now what do they do? And how long Reboot the machine which will run the vendor supplied script to automatically start online. , If the online server fails to start then THEY HAVE A SERIOUS PROBLEM AND PROBABLE DATA CORRUPTION So they should run a server which will ignore this and carry on running, accessing corrupt data? They can either call the vendor or call informix who can dail-in to fix it 50 pound for a modem, use any spare phone line. >will they be down for without an inhouse DBA? > As long as a reboot takes or as long as it takes the Informix system down team to fix it. > >________________________________________________________________________ >Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com >

I'm surprised Informix et al does not provide some level of support, paid or otherwise in a situation where a certimufied datamybase DBA isn't available. If I were in charge of support in your region I'd make sure every customer is supported, and SOLD support contracts. Customers will pay when properly sold. I know. I was in sales about 15 years ago, working my way through school. I was in the top 5 of 66 sales people consistently, selling sound equipment hardware. I simply enojyed selling the stuff. Perhaps if I had stayed with it... C'est la vie... An off-site DBA resource should be an available option for any customer. In fact, it's a job that could be done with one DBA or DBA team taking care of several sites, sharing the cost amongst several customers. This is nothing new in conzept, many larger vendors used to offer on-site or shared resources ages ago. No reason why it couldn't work with DBA functions. In fact Informix could co-op with local consultancies in working with Informix customers to make sure every single customer in a region is supported by either Informix employees or contractors/consultants in a region. A great way to build a larger virtual base of professionals representing Informix and not the competition. ( They used to call them VARs, and such. ) :-) Tim smooth1 wrote: > > Obnoxio The Clown wrote in message <8nb3in$qb4$1@news.xmission.com>... > > > >From: "smooth1" <smooth1@iclway.co.uk> > >> > >>Obnoxio The Clown wrote in message <8n8ddm$8g6$1@news.xmission.com>... > >> >> Hence, my backups are corrupt, I can't handle crashes, kill errant > >> >> users and I won't know about corruption until someone spots > >> >> that the system is producing crap data (if this gets spotted at > >>all!). > >> >> > >> >> SE is out of data in terms of data integrity and should be dropped > >> >> in favour of IDS Workgroup Edition. > >> > > >> >That's all fine and dandy, David, but what about small sites who can't > >> >afford a DBA and just want a simple database platform? > >> > > >> > >> Why does online need a DBA? You can > >> > >> automate start and shutdown > >> automate backups with onbar and ISM. > > > >And you can automate the price difference, too? Is there anybody out there, > >please tell me if there is, who has a totally hands off IDS instance? I've > >*never* seen one, and I've seen plenty of IDS sites, believe me. > > > >> If online panics then that is only to stop data corruption. > >> > >> Are you saying it is ok for your customer to have undetected > >> corrupt data? > > > >Oh, come on, David. > > > > Come on? I have seen this happen several times. Just ask a > collegue who I left repairing a SE database at 6pm and who > called me at home at 4am to say our servers were rebooting > for backups and he was losing his connection to the customer! > > >> Please let me know the names of the customer for whom this is ok > >> and I'll pass onto them the good news. > > > >OK, smarty pants. Now they have an AF. Now what do they do? And how long > > Reboot the machine which will run the vendor supplied script to > automatically start online. > > , If the online server fails to start then > > THEY HAVE A SERIOUS PROBLEM AND PROBABLE DATA > CORRUPTION > > So they should run a server which will ignore this and carry on > running, accessing corrupt data? > > They can either call the vendor or call informix who can > dail-in to fix it > > 50 pound for a modem, use any spare phone line. > > >will they be down for without an inhouse DBA? > > > > As long as a reboot takes or as long as it takes the Informix > system down team to fix it. > > > > >________________________________________________________________________ > >Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com > > -- . .- .-- .--- .---- Tim Schaefer .----- tschaefe@bellsouth.net .---- http://www.inxutil.com .--- .-- .- .